MJ REBUTTAL (Last one, I swear)
So I've caught a lot of flak from my last missive in which I trumpet Michael Jackson's importance. Friends of mine came out of the woodwork and beat me up, saying that I was exaggerating, that he cannot be put on the mantle of musical greats, since at best he was a great dancer/singer and "music video innovator," and that his pathetic slide in freakshow works as some kind of negative stock against his true contributions.
Fair enough. I was steaming drunk when I posted it and may have been guilty of hyperbole. I've been thinking it over the last couple of days and I go back and forth.
I never thought I'd be put in the position of defending Michael Jackson - someone who has elicited derisive sneers from me for much of my life - and I do agree with much of what the detractors are saying.
BUT...
I gotta say that I detect a whole lotta condescending priveleged white guy scoffs in these comments, that they are overthought and, dare I say, elitist. To say that Brian Wilson is greater than Michael Jackson raises eyebrows for sure. Wilson is indeed a genius and has influenced countless artists, but go ANYWHERE in the third world and mention his name and I fucking guarantee you will be met with blank stares. Mention Jackson, and most will not only know who he is - they will like his music. This is especially true among poor brown and black people. I bet John Lennon doesn't even turn up on most of their radar screens. And this is the majority of the Earth's population. So how important does that really make him, when really, today, he's not as known or admired as you may think?
To answer Angry Steve, Jackson HAS been massively influential. He wrote the book on modern pop - from boy band schlock to R and B to what you might call "dance music." Who has he exactly influenced, you ask? Timberlake, Usher, Babyface, R. Kelly, Britney Spears to name a few. Sure, a lot of it is commercial and awful, but it's very popular. I know that's not necessarily the barometer of good, but we can't ignore it either. Can you write off his influence just because you DON'T LIKE his music, because it's not COOL enough for you?
That's fine, but what needs to be realized is that Jackson was truly international, and aside from Bob Marley, he was the first black artists to go global, to be embraced by everybody. He paved the way for hip-hop's now global appeal, so you can't divorce him from its success. For a while he was more famous than any human had ever been before. He was huger than huge. It was almost sick. But you can't deny that despite his own bizarre racial self-loathing that he indeed broke down barriers. It can be argued that Jackson made it possible for a Tiger Woods or even a Barak Obama to happen.
Michael Jackson had planned a comeback tour - which was obviously going to be a disaster of Hindenburgian proportions - and yet 750,000 thousand tickets had already been sold. 750,000. That's a fucking heaping jolly shitload.
So yeah, he mattered to people. A lot of people. They might not be the kind people you consider or like, but they live all over this globe and have opinions on music, just like you and me.
Fair enough. I was steaming drunk when I posted it and may have been guilty of hyperbole. I've been thinking it over the last couple of days and I go back and forth.
I never thought I'd be put in the position of defending Michael Jackson - someone who has elicited derisive sneers from me for much of my life - and I do agree with much of what the detractors are saying.
BUT...
I gotta say that I detect a whole lotta condescending priveleged white guy scoffs in these comments, that they are overthought and, dare I say, elitist. To say that Brian Wilson is greater than Michael Jackson raises eyebrows for sure. Wilson is indeed a genius and has influenced countless artists, but go ANYWHERE in the third world and mention his name and I fucking guarantee you will be met with blank stares. Mention Jackson, and most will not only know who he is - they will like his music. This is especially true among poor brown and black people. I bet John Lennon doesn't even turn up on most of their radar screens. And this is the majority of the Earth's population. So how important does that really make him, when really, today, he's not as known or admired as you may think?
To answer Angry Steve, Jackson HAS been massively influential. He wrote the book on modern pop - from boy band schlock to R and B to what you might call "dance music." Who has he exactly influenced, you ask? Timberlake, Usher, Babyface, R. Kelly, Britney Spears to name a few. Sure, a lot of it is commercial and awful, but it's very popular. I know that's not necessarily the barometer of good, but we can't ignore it either. Can you write off his influence just because you DON'T LIKE his music, because it's not COOL enough for you?
That's fine, but what needs to be realized is that Jackson was truly international, and aside from Bob Marley, he was the first black artists to go global, to be embraced by everybody. He paved the way for hip-hop's now global appeal, so you can't divorce him from its success. For a while he was more famous than any human had ever been before. He was huger than huge. It was almost sick. But you can't deny that despite his own bizarre racial self-loathing that he indeed broke down barriers. It can be argued that Jackson made it possible for a Tiger Woods or even a Barak Obama to happen.
Michael Jackson had planned a comeback tour - which was obviously going to be a disaster of Hindenburgian proportions - and yet 750,000 thousand tickets had already been sold. 750,000. That's a fucking heaping jolly shitload.
So yeah, he mattered to people. A lot of people. They might not be the kind people you consider or like, but they live all over this globe and have opinions on music, just like you and me.

If he'd died fifteen years ago this debate about his music wouldn't even be considered. But instead fifteen years ago he stopped making relevant music and decided to focus on.....other pursuits....
On a global scale, Jackson was one of the most famous people in the world, and probably the most famous entertainer. A week ago he was alive, now he's dead. So folks need to stop being so cynical and give at least a little respect where it's due.
(Anonymous)
Yet, has MJ influenced those "artists" you mentioned MUSICALLY, or merely in terms of style, fashion, look, stage show, and other shallow pop elements? And even then, it's probably only the producers/song-writers/handlers that were influenced.
Say one thing for MJ, he did all his own shit. He was not a cynical package put together by slick producers to sell to teenyboppers.
Look, I'm not a pop-hater. More of a pop-distruster. I think one of the best points made by a lot of commentators is that we will probably never have such a great pop unifying presence ever again. And that much is probably true. Like you said in the 1st post, a lot of us tried to sneer and hate back in the day, but it was just for show. NOBODY didn't like Thriller.
--angry--
And then I thought, "Holy fuck, this guy's good, too."
TERRIBLE MOVIE.
Not going to dis Jacko now; I've told far too many jokes at his expense already. I acknowledge his extreme importance . . . still thought his best album may have been "Off the Wall" . . . .
Yes, for the past 15 years he's been a blight. The fame went to his head and he clearly made a lot of big mistakes. He might have molested children, which is NOT OKAY. But he also donated massively to charities and fundraisers. He also inspired the world.
(Anonymous)
Who is Brian Wilson?
JB
Wait - who the hell is Brian Wilson?
(Anonymous)
Nothing to do with your post but funny
(Anonymous)
The Ultimate in MJ Hating
http://kunstler.com/blog/2009/06/the-man-i
--angry--
(Anonymous)
Hitler's reaction
(Anonymous)
Would have to disagree strongly. People below a certain age don't know his music because he has been off the pop radar for years. Ask any Korean teenager if they even know who he is; every one I've asked doesn't know him. Same for Lennon, but his work still turns up from time to time, in movies, ads, soundtracks, and karaoke song catalogs all over the world.
If you want to talk popularity, sure, you could win a pissing contest with Brian Wilson, Lennon maybe, even Muhammad Ali. But if you want to talk influence, I'd agree with the posters who point out that most of his influence was superficial, not musical, and not entirely his own even in that regard.
The world was busy forgetting him before he prematurely checked out and will continue to do so shortly after all this nonsense quiets down.
JB
(Anonymous)
Friends don't let friends drink and blog
JB
Re: Friends don't let friends drink and blog
I'll defend The Holocaust if drunk enough.